[Marxism] Which prophets really existed ?
shmage at pipeline.com
Sun Sep 23 14:11:49 MDT 2012
On Sep 23, 2012, at 2:19 PM, DW wrote:
> This is ALL solvable by genetics now. Guess what? There are relations
> between *most* Jews in the general Sephardi and Ashkenazi genetic
> lines and little if any between Ashkenazi and Khazaris...
How can you say such a thing? There are no contemporary Khazars and
have been none for many centuries--and the article you cite doesn't
claim to have found any let alone analyzed their DNA. Of course the
Sephardi and Ashkenazi genetic lines are related since both groups (I
contend) derive from a common population--the "mixed multitude" that
left Egypt during the catastrophe recorded in Exodus. That link would
argue against the Khazar origin of the Polish Jewry (the Hungarian
Jews came from the East together with the Magyars from Khazar
territory escaping the Mongol invasion--which is evidently why
Koestler was so concerned with this question) only if the Khazar
population was entirely "Turkic converts" who were converted in the
9th century CE, long after the period of Jewish proselytization had
ended. And in that case the question would have to be asked--who
converted them and why (if Judaism was unknown to them) did they
accept conversion to a powerless and despised religion? (the story--
that a Khazar king asked a Christian which religion was worse, Judaism
or Islam, and was told "Islam" and then when he asked a Muslim which
was worse, Judaism or Christianity, was told "Christianity," and so
adopted Judaism as less alienating for his powerful neighbors--that
story is pure fable, not even rising to the level of legend).
There is another consideration. The quoted article accepts fully the
finding of a DNA-similarity among Jews of all races and nations named
"Cohen," denoting descent from Aaron, the first priest. The high
priest of the Khazars was the "Kagan," while the king was the war
leader, replicating the Jewish tradition of a division of those two
functions which was already present at formation of the first monarchy
(Saul/Samuel) and was intact at the very end, when John the Baptizer
(descended from Aaron) and Jesus the Messianic King (descended from
David via his mother) replicated it. Since many Ashkenazi Jews, (like
the SCOTUS member) bear some variation of the name "Kagan" some light
on the Khazar-origin hypothesis might well by shed by testing for a
genetic match between "Cohens" and "Kagans."
> The motive force behind trying to prove one truth vs another truth in
> this ridiculous debate is establish or debunk the legitimacy of
> Zionist claims of 'one people' and other nonsense.
The Khazar theory was developed in the 19th century. Refutation of
racist Zionist nonsense wasn't Koestler's purpose in defending it, let
alone mine. Establishment of historical truth--about anything and
everything--is sufficient purpose in and of itself.
This cosmos did none of gods or men make, but it
always was and is and shall be: an everlasting fire,
kindling in measures and going out in measures.
Herakleitos of Ephesos
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