Lenin & nationalism

Louis N Proyect lnp3 at columbia.edu
Fri Apr 7 12:19:16 MDT 1995


Louis Proyect:

Is there some problem here?

In one paragraph--a quote from Paul Mattick--we get a polemic against Max
Schachtman for still supporting nationalism despite the fact that
"liberated" nations are forming a fascist ring around the USSR.

In the second paragraph, Trotter tells us to WATCH OUT: the PLO, IRA and the
ANC are going to shoot down the workers. Isn't there a paragraph or
paragraphs missing between these 2? Can this gap in the logical
presentation of ideas be possibly explained by a malfunction in TCP/IP?
Perhaps the missing paragraphs were siphoned off by the CIA as part of a
counterintelligence operation. We need more an iron-clad, bullet-proof
internet communications protocol, or perhaps, more logically constructed
contributions to the discussion.

On Fri, 7 Apr 1995, Alex Trotter wrote:

>
> In his post concerning the Bolshevik nationalities policy (consisting
> mostly of quotes from Lenin) Tom Condit correctly points out that Lenin
> did not support nationalism itself, only the "right" to national
> self-determination. And so Lenin's position on imperialism was more
> sophisticated than that of his rotten third-worldist and Stalinist
> epigones. Nonetheless, his policy, which became the Bolshevik Party's
> official position, was mistaken, and opened the door to the later
> nationalist movements and military coups masquerading as proletarian
> revolutions. In answer to the Lenin quotes, I offer here one from Paul
> Mattick:
>
> "The 'liberated' nations form a fascist ring around Russia. 'Liberated'
> Turkey shoots down the communists with arms supllied to her by Russia.
> China, supported in its national struggle for freedom by Russia and the
> Third International, throttles its labor movement in a manner reminiscent
> of the Paris Commune. Thousands and thousands of workers' corpses are
> testimony of the correctness of Rosa Luxemburg's view that the phrase
> about the right of self-determination of nations is nothing but 'petty
> bourgeois humbug.' The extent to which the 'struggle for national
> liberation is a struggle for democracy' (lenin) is surely revealed by the
> nationalistic adventures of the Third International in Germany,
> adventures which contributed their share to the preconditions for the
> victory of fascism. Ten years of competition with Hitler for the title to
> real nationalism turned the workers themselves into fascists. And
> Litvinov celebrated in the League of Nations the victory of the Leninist
> idea of the self-determination of peoples on the occasion of the Saar
> plebiscite. Truly, in view of this development, one must indeed wonder at
> people like Max Schactman who still today are capable of saying: 'Despite
> the sharp criticism levelled by Rosa at the Bolsheviks for their national
> policy after the revolution, the latter was nevertheless confirmed by
> results.'" [in _The Modern Monthly_; quote by Schactman from _The New
> International_, March 1935]
>
> And we can, no doubt, look forward to the day when IRA, PLO, and ANC
> governments will shoot down the workers. So put that in your pipe and
> smoke it, comrades.
>
> --AT
>
>
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>
>
>


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