Trotsky: Permanent revolution & Nicaragua

han win0096 at
Wed Aug 2 16:27:01 MDT 1995

>On Wed, 2 Aug 1995, han wrote:
>> This is where the permanent revoltion comes in.  Trotsky called this a
>> socialist revolution anyway.  He tells the masses that a
>> socialist revolution is not needed because we already have a socialist
>> revolution. By saying this he disarms the masses, they do not continue
>> their fight to take over the tools of production.  Trotsky tells them it
>> is not needed.
>Louis Proyect:
>When and where did you read this in Trotsky? You say that Trotsky
>"called" this a socialist revolution anyway. He "tells" the masses that a
>socialist revolution is not needed. By "saying" this he disarms the
>masses. Now I am not a Trotskyist, but I have learned from many of his
>writings. You seem to have a superior understanding of his writings. In
>fact, you represent yourself as some kind of expert on his thoughts, so
>it shouldn't be hard to provide some quotations from his writings where
>he "called", "told" and "said" all of the things you claim.
You probably are right with your note.
I don't think I have a superior understanding of Trotky's writings.  But I
ame an active member of a communist party, and as yoy probably knouw,
communists study to evaluate ther work on the field.  And where we are,
there are Trotkyst's, somethimes we work together but most of the time we
have a different opninion.  We do not have a different opinion becolse we
feel like we need to have a different opinion.  But becolse we have
different conception of revolution, socialism, Marx,...
So we need a good understanding of Trotsky's writings and those who proclaim
to be his folowers.

When I said Trotsky on the Nicaryan subject I meant Trotkyst paty's, groups,
fractions,...  Trotky didn't live when alle this was happening.

Four my sources.
Rood : the newspaper of belgium's main Trotskyst party, The Impressor (news
letter of the fouth International).  And probably yoyr local newsletter of
one of the many Trotkyst groups.

If I said : "telling" ...." "or by saing this he..."
I was talking about the effects the idea of the permanent revolution has is
real life.
On the Nicargua subject they said no Socialist revoltion was needed becolse
it already the Nicaraguan revolution alredy had been a socialist revolution
and not a National Democratic revolution.
Maybe if there are some Trotkyst's in the group they could tell me if I ame
wrong on this subject.  If ther is a member of a Australian trotskyst group,
this could be intresting, they dismantled their group on this subject (as
far as I knouw).

Louis Project
>One of the things you'll learn about participating in this list is that
>you don't have the luxury of co-thinkers nodding their heads approvingly
>everytime you make statements that are part of your official party
>ideology. We come from many different traditions and have many different
>perspectives, so don't be surprised if some of us are a little rough with
>you when you say something that seems to be totally ignorant.

han :
" Na advance without strugle"
I ame oposed to poeple being rough with one another.  But i don't think that
is what a discussion or debate is about.  As for me a debate should be hard,
we should all try to be clear about our conception's and idear's.
I want to learn something from a debate and ther is no way that we learn
something if we al agree.
I can asure you that within my party there is a great culture of debate,
discussion, strugle,...  That is what makes us strong, this is what makes us

han, Belgium

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