Ken Howard kenhow at werple.mira.net.au
Fri Apr 12 05:20:59 MDT 1996

>    The PCP crowd, like so many ultra-left opportunist Marxist groups over
>the last century, fucks up Marxism, and (not so incidentally) fucks up the
>language in which Marxists can talk to each other. "Decadent" (despite some
>decent use by Caudwell and others) probably does not belong in the Marxist
>vocabulary. "imperialist bourgeois" does--and if it has been ruined by the
>likes of the PCP, it must either be refurbished or a new coinage created.
>    Incidentally, jargon has both its uses and abuses. Its use lies in the
>necessity, in any mass political movement, of a shared vocabulary: shared
>between and among leaders, intellectuals, and mass membership. One "advantage
>"advantage" intellectuals have over non-intellectuals is the capacity to
>endlessly vary their vocabulary. To require them to stick to an established
>vocabulary (a jargon) to some extent evens the playing field between
>general populace and intellectuals.
>        Carrol Cox
>> After hitting the "delete" key for so many weeks, I decided to take a
>> quick look at this thread.  My, my, my... I see things are getting even
>> lower than I had dreamed.
>> It is really nice seeing people throwing epithets around -- "imperialist
>> bourgeois" and "decadent gays" and the like.
>> All I can say is, this decadent bourgeois libertarian knows one thing:
>> socialist regimes are on a par with fundamentalist regimes in
>> their disdain and oppression of gays and lesbians.  On this, they can
>> join hands with the religious right, except that the religious right in
>> the United States has yet to exercise the degree of statist repression
>> exhibited by their socialist counterparts in Cuba, China, and the like.
>> Clean up your own houses before hurling accusations at your "class" enemies.
>>                     - Chris
>> ==================================================
>> Dr. Chris M. Sciabarra
>> Visiting Scholar, NYU Department of Politics
>> INTERNET:  sciabrrc at is2.nyu.edu
>> http://pages.nyu.edu/~sciabrrc
>> ==================================================
>>      --- from list marxism at lists.village.virginia.edu ---
Ken Howard. Carol. I'm not sure of your distinction between "intellectuals"
and workers. Is it a distinction on the basis of some :"formal" access to
>>Many of the working class leaders I come in contact with have no high
>>formal education and can talk very clearly about the rate of exploitation
>>etc.Political clarity or understanding is not the preserve of tyhe highly
>>educated. As a unionist i work closely with transport workers, ie truck
>>drivers. Many would put the so called highly educated on this list to
>>shame, not by the use of highly refined understanding of modernism or
>>post modernism but by a clear understanding of the nature of the ideology
>>of the society and the problems with it in terms of being human beings.>
>I agree with your comments in the contribution you made. I only add that
>the net result of the way in which the adherents of the PCP assaulted the
>list, not by their positions but by their language of fear and
>intimidation, and the very male level of assault has not done a service to
>either discusssion or clarification. Clearly over the last few days a fear
>has permeated the list  and subjects of potential controversy are avoided
>for fear of ambush either for stupidity or right opportunism. This I
>believe is most unfortunate as in the end the adherents of the PCP have
>appeared to have succeeded in reducing the discussion to a level of
I hope this is not permanent and that there remains an ability to explore
and learn from the reality of life under capitalism, as shitty and
simplistic as it is. Like I mean that there seems little ability or
willingness to explore the real life experiences of people on this list,
warts and all, for fear that they will be ridiculed. In the end if this
list is only for the extrapolation of individual egotisitical dirges on
their pet theories I'm not sure that it has any other purpose then
amusement for the vast bulk of subscribers. And clearly most people on this
list are not interested in these kinds of polemics. I believe there are
many issues that need to be explored. Issues of understanding the world in
which we are forced to live, ie. globalisation, neo-liberalism,caultural
conservatism, retraction of measures of social protection, privtisation and
the oppossition in working class consciousness and action to the new
capitalist order. But perhaps this cannot be a task for intellectual
extrapolation or the quotes from the well read, but an actual discussion
amongst the wage slaves which may not be of much interest to the book
>Ken Howard.
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