Carlos on Shiny Shit

CEP iwp.ilo at
Sat Feb 10 16:11:28 MST 1996

You (Chris) wrote:
>Dear Carlos,
>The bitterness of your posts about the PCP and Shining Path ("Shiny
Shit" etc)
>make me wonder if you have personal experience of losing comrades
>as a result of their executions of "collaborators".

    Carlos Replies:

    As it is obvious for anyone who bother to read Shiny Shit
    supporters' posts (Godenas, Quispe et al), they did:

    a. Recognize that they did execute other left wing activists
    under the accussation of being "agents" of imperialism, the
    Fujimori government or some other source of counter-revolution.

    b. They repeatdely *refused* to ellaborate about the process it
    was followed before those executions took place.  They only
    referred to some Shiny-shit controlled "tribunals".  This is
    simply because *they never gave the accussed the opportunity of
    proving their innocence* (I'm not talking here about people killed
    during an armed confrontation, I'm talking about *executions* and
    not of police or army officers, but of left-wing members of other

    c. I have direct knowledge of the execution of members of the
    Peruvian Communist Party, the MAS (Movement of Socialist Action?),
    the PUM (Unified Mariateguist Party) and of members of the United
    Left (Izquierda Unida).  In all, maybe 15 cases.  I have
    references, through reading materials produced by left wing
    organizations from Peru of about another 100-150 cases.  In books
    and other sources is mentioned a number of 500 or so (of left wing
    activists, elected officers and tradeunion leaders assasinated
    without trial, without any legitimate due process,etc)

    With most of the murdered I have no political agreement.  Moreover,
    I would, if they were alive, consider them social-reformers (with
    maybe the exception of the members from the PUM).  *But*, the
    questions are not their politics but their assasinations.  In that
    sense I'm stand on the side of every left wing element murdered by
    Sendero. It is a blood line here, a class line.

    d. By their own recognition (Shiny Shit supporters), they are a
    bunch of reformist Maoists of the worst kind.  All the *war* they
    are waging is to *pressure* the "national bourgeoisie* to side with
    them.  You see, the method in war is the same they try
    unsuccesfully to apply in this list.  Namely, there is Fujimori or
    us, Shiny Shit, you need to choose us if not you are in the other
    side.  Old argument, shity logic. That's is why they kill other
    leftists, they need no other voice in order to blackmail workers
    and peasants.  Dind't work here and *it is not working in Peru*.
    Shiny Shit is nothing but that.  Have no overwhelming support

    e. Terrorism is very easy.  You don not need to organize the
    masses, nor as they say, you need any kind of support from the
    working class and the oppressed to be effective.  Five hundred
    well trained fanatics canput 5,000 bombs in one year.  Doesn't
    even require to be class-conscious nor to know anything about
    program.  Provided tht you develop a good security system, you
    can go on and on for years.  That's what Shiny Shit is.

    But even if *they enjoyed* mass suppport that would not change
    my position towards them.  Can you imagine a society with them
    in charge? You'll probably be executed, Chris.  That simple.

    Chris wrote:

 Of does it somehow >relate to events in Argentina?

    Carlos replies:

    To some extent the ERP in Argentina, and the Montoneros in their
    last stage did some similar things than Shiny Shit.  I oppossed
    them politically, and somehow succesfully I would say (at least
    we compited with them in the mass movement and we were ahead
    at certain stages).  But ERP and Montoneros *never* had a conscious
    policy of killing political opponents from the left systematically.

    As a matter of fact, I don't remember a single case like that.
    Their similiraties with Shiny Shit (at the stage in which they
    were very decomposed) was brutal terrorist attacks which were
    indiscriminate and, sometimes, ended up with innocent bystanders
    receiving a bullet. Quite different, though reprehensible.

    Suffice to read the defense of Shiny Shit of Stalin and Stalin
    crimes and the shamefull cover up of members of the CPUSA of
    Shiny Shit to confirm what I said many times: if we do not get
    rid of the last vestiges of Stalinism, which destroyed to
    Marxist movement once, we are condemned to go through the same

    Sometimes I got frustrated with the arm-chair Marxist intellectuals
    (not at all a personal allussion to anyone)who seems to believe
    that one can have a *clarifying* discussion with supporters of this
    gang of murderers.  In other words, Chris, there are some
    principples Marxists, all Marxists, should not break.  Not killing
    political opponents in the left is one.

    Paraphrasing Clausevitz: Political discussion is a war by other
    means.  Our discussion in this list with Shiny Shit should be based
    on the same basis as if we were there and Godenas just shoot Louis
    Project.  Nobody will argue than Louis and I have our differences.
    But in this matter ... we are in a united front (basic working
    class principples).

    I have many criticisms of the FSLN but my former political
    associates and myself fougth militarily alongside with them
    for over a year in Nicaragua against the Somoza's National
    Guard.  Then we confronted them politically.  But that doesn't
    blurr my vision and I know that the FSLN *overthrew* a sinister
    dictatorship (that of Somoza).  Shiny Shit *brought* the Fujimori
    dictatorship by their actions, provocations that subverted not the
    bourgeois order but the support of the Peruvian working class
    to left politics.

    I call you and all other who call themselves Marxists or simply
    decent human beings to opposse firmly Shiny Shit by not giving
    or granting them any credibility or support.  This is not only
    a princippled stand but also a survival skill all in this list
    will be smart to adcquire.

    I hope I answered your questions.  BTW, I'm not bitter,  I only
    think that Shiny Shit does not deserve, nor I'm willing to give
    them any quarter.



>If so, you may feel you do not want to go into details, but if it is
>possible I would appreciate your comments.
>Chris B
>     --- from list marxism at ---

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