M2 on Usenet...

Robert Malecki malecki at algonet.se
Fri May 24 13:05:35 MDT 1996


The following was posted to the newsgroups today. as it also takes up quite
a few of the people on M1 in a very detrimental way and at the sametime
demands that i give names of people, i send it for your information. Quite a
number of people have been asking for names. I refuse on principle and a
matter of security for the people involved, especially the PCP people in
giving names publicly.However i will answer the letter with out giving names
and send it down later..

malecki in exile....

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On May 20, 1996 20:34:08 in article <Cowards at Jefferson village!>,
'malecki at algonet.se (Robert Malecki)' wrote on his criticisms of the
discussion list called "marxism 2" or "M2". He wrote similar material in an
earlier post on the same day at 20:11 under the subject head "'Marxist
list" says working class kids not welcome!"

Since his posts were public I will respond to his criticisms in public as
well.

R. Malecki asks us collectively to act, based on his assertions. Alas, he
has not documented any of those assertions despite the *severe* nature of
his claims, particularly around the issue of "executions." Assuming that
the alledged executions occured without color of law this is, in effect, an
accusation that murders have been committed by his political opponents on
the left and are related to battles involving internet discussion groups.

Both the public character of his accusations and the extreme nature of his
claims creates an obligation on his part ot present detailed factual
information to substantiate his accusations. This includes:

1) Where and when did M2 ever state that "working class kids [are] not
welcome?"

2) How, if the M2 list was created *after* an "attempt to expel the PCP
peruvians in a bureautic way" does such an alledged expulsion attempt
reflect on M2?

3) On what basis and with what data does he conclude that the forces he
calls the "PCP Peruvians" relect the official views/membership of the PCP?

4) Who was tried at the first "secret trial" on M2? Who was tried at the
second "secret trial?" And how many other "secret trials" on M2 does he
know about. On what basis and with what data does he conclude that there
were any "secret trials" at all?

5) Who was first "executed?" Who was the victim of the second "execution?"
And how many other "executions" related to M2 does he know about? On what
basis and with what data does he conclude that people were murdered
relating to activities by M2?

6) M2 is a discussion list, not a well-defined political organization.
Consequently, who are the individuals or political organizations (or both)
that he refers to as "they?"

7) Would he quote the exact wording of the "main rule" on m2 forbids people
to "discuss how the list was created?" Failing this, on what basis and with
what data does he conclude that such a rule forbidding this discussion
exists and that it is the "main" one?

In a yet earlier post on May 19, Malecki made a number of additional
assertions about M2. Relating to these:

8) He maintains that the M2 list was created by a "kangaroo court" and
"cops." Who were the members of the court and how can a court create a
list? Who are the police that he mentions? Why, if he wishes to get cops
"off the internet" is he posting to alt.politics.socialism.trotsky instead
of to the groups on the net who have an ongoing and open police presence?

9) As above, on what basis and with what data does he conclude that M2
holds "secret trials" and "secret executions?"

Many of his claims are, I infer, related to previous disputes concerning
the abusive behavior of people claiming membership in or formal support of
the PCP. When claims and counter claims were made some months ago I asked
both sides for the raw data on which their claims were based.

I received detailed material from Dave McReynold's (of the WRL and SPUSA)
and others documenting highly abusive by the ostensible PCP forces.

I received little or nothing from the ostensible PCP forces and their
supporters.

I also asked both sides for any information documenting claims by the
ostensible PCP forces to actually be PCP or to officially represent the PCP
in the USA. I received no data from any side here.

I reached certain conclusion from the data that both sides had the
opportunity to present. Put another way, I did not base my conclusions on
any wishes, desires, or presuppositions.

The first was that the ostensible PCP forces had indeed been highly abusive
to other forces.

The second was that the ostensible PCP forces had done little else but
behave in the highly abusive way.

The third was that it was highly unlikely that they in any way represented
the real PCP. This conclusion was furthered by other claims of a dubious
nature made by the ostensible PCP forces. These included an assertion that
one of the ostensible PCPers had been high enough in the old pro-Soviet
international hierarchy to have personally met Kim Philby in Moscow. The
second was that there were official PCP assassination teams active in the
USA conducting real executions on critics of the PCP.

The fourth was the ostensible PCP forces had created a bad parody created
more from biased reports in the US press of how the PCP was supposed to
act.

The fifth was that other leftists critical of the real PCP were perfectly
happy to atrribute the behavior of the pseudo-PCP posting on the internet
to the real PCP and to criticize the real PCP on the basis of that
behavior.

--tallpaul

--tallpaul




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