workers councils and democracy?
mikalac at SPAMworldnet.att.net
Sat Aug 19 12:40:14 MDT 2000
hhmmmm ..... so that's why we had all those ethnic fights as kids! it
was all their fault .... well .... no .... their heritage .... that they
brought with them to our neighborhood. no doubt about it: bring up
people like animals and they'll act like them.
back to socialist/marxist organization. at pen-l (or was it lbo?) there
was a long and very interesting discussion of planned vs. market
socialism. that's the economy. also interspersed were snatches of how
the polity would function, but i couldn't follow the drift. assuming a
democratic political environment, how would that function? an
executive, a legislature, a judiciary? if these questions are in the
FAQs, then ignore them and i'll pick up the answers there in a while.
Michael Perelman wrote:
> Yes, the Southern Italians are supposed to be not selfish, but "amoral
> famialists" -- unable to cooperate.
> A'Hearn, Brian. 2000. "Could Southern Italians Cooperate? Banche Popolari
> in the Mezzogiorno."
> The Journal of Economic History, 60: 1 (March): pp. 67-9
> shows that they could.
> Instead, it seems that their behavior was a rational adaptive response to
> poverty, which became transformed into a kind of "racism," especially
> since S. Italy, especially Sicilly seems to have had a strong influx of
> immigrants from Africa, sometime in the very distant past.
> Patrick Bond wrote:
> > I just saw an interesting (1999) PhD on this, from a London
> > university (forget which), very much in the Ev.Psych. tradition but
> > adding a dash of decent politics. A guy called David Erdahl, who runs
> > a worker self-management centre in England (which gets support
> > from Stiglitz's talented radical pal in the World Bank, David
> > Ellerman), compared Northern Italian towns, using as the main basis
> > for contrast the extent of self-management in local enterprises. He
> > did lots of surveying of various social indicators, and concluded
> > that there is a strong case for collectivity overcoming
> > individualism. It's not about genetics, but having coops as a
> > hegemonic building block for local social relations.
> > (And this doesn't imply we want to use coops as vanguard for
> > socialist revolution.)
> > > Subject: Re: workers councils and democracy?
> > > unless the geneticists can exorcize our selfish and
> > > acquisitive genes, i can't see how the utopias can flourish.
> > Patrick Bond (pbond at wn.apc.org)
> > home: 51 Somerset Road, Kensington 2094 South Africa
> > phone: (2711) 614-8088
> > work: University of the Witwatersrand
> > Graduate School of Public and Development Management
> > PO Box 601, Wits 2050, South Africa
> > work email: bond.p at pdm.wits.ac.za
> > work phone: (2711) 717-3917
> > work fax: (2711) 484-2729
> > cellphone: (27) 83-633-5548
> Michael Perelman
> Economics Department
> California State University
> Chico, CA 95929
> Tel. 530-898-5321
> E-Mail michael at ecst.csuchico.edu
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