Are the Taliban fascists?

Borba100 at Borba100 at
Thu Dec 6 08:39:51 MST 2001

In a message dated 12/6/01 10:21:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, 
mark.jones at writes:

<< Here's a nice little story about 
 the kind of people you've been rushing to defend, ie, the Russian mafia, 
 which I just posted to the A-List. >>

 Mark don't you think it cheapens you to grotesquely misrepresent an 
opponent's views?  I never defended the Russian Mafia (though Empeor's 
Clothes has defended Borodin, the Russian diplomat who you KNOW is a 
gangster, from illegal arrest in New York). Don't your remember? You made 
your brilliant  "gramaphone" analysis in response to my defense of Milosevic, 
who you also accused of being a gangster. 

Here is how Nestor Gorojovsky replied to you, at the time:

Subj:    [CrashList] Vicious attacks on Jared Israel (2nd. time I send this) 
Date:   4/7/01 3:33:46 PM Eastern Daylight Time 
From:   Gorojovsky at (Gorojovsky)
Sender: crashlist-admin at 
Reply-to:   crashlist at 
To: crashlist at, Borba100 at, jones.mark at 
(Mark Jones)

"This message has been sent to CrashList more than three days ago, and it has 
not appeared on the list. I guess that if it still doesn't appear I should 
send it elsewhere so it can be read."

> > Jared Israel reminds me of Arthur Koestler's famous description of a > 
typical Stalinist commissar in the USSR in the 1930s, as someone who is 'part 

> gangster, part gramophone' …His Master…Milosevic, who combines 
self-pity > with political gangsterism in equal measure, now has a record of 
almost  > absolute political failure. 

The above is as false as a line from Reuter's but it also contains a vein of 
vicious attack on Israel which, since I share most of his ideas on the 
Yugoslav drama, extends to me somehow. 

Calling Milosevic a gangster and self-pitying, and Jared a mixture of  
gangster and gramophone is, IMHO, simply a stupid gutter lie worthy of CNN at 
 their worst. I spent time talking with Mr. Milosevic and he has not the 
least  amount of self pity, and has great clarity about imperialism. As to 
Jared in particular, I would add that I would honestly like to have hundreds 
of gramophones with so great a sense of political integrity, of honesty to 
the people, of love for truth, and of personal boldness. His service to the 
cause  of Yugoslavs, and thus to all the oppressed peoples in the world, is  
outstanding. What would be known all over the world about Yugoslavia without  
his I wish Argentineans had had a single in 1945 
and  in 1955, when the CNNs of those times roared that we were the Nazis of 
South  America! 

And let me put this clear, too: I agree with most that he posts in that  
Emperors Clothes web site(one of the most exemplary ways to use the Net for a 
 good cause, in fact: it is due to pages such as those that the powerful ones 
 are trying to smother free speech on the Net), but I would still believe the 
 above on Jared Israel even _if_ I did not agree so much. 

Everyone here knows that I am careful with personal attacks in my postings, 
and this is not a matter of personal softness. It is a matter of political 
seriousness. Slandering, insulting and debased language, as Mark  Jones is 
now using to discredit Jared Israel and President Milosevic, are not a 

tradition of great revolutionaries but one that betrays the final belief that 
insult is "good proletarian practice", thus keeping working class people far 
away from the weapons of reasoned discourse and critical thought. Thus, it is 
one of the worst trends among our movement, a trend that we should  always 

This I would call the worst kind of Stalinist bureaucratic debasement of 
human speech abilities. And I am afraid Mark has fallen into that, much to my 
grief and to his shame. I honestly wish that he gets out of that pitfall as 
soon as  possible. ------- End of forwarded message -------

Néstor Miguel Gorojovsky gorojovsky at 

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