Was Lenin So Blind? Reply to Nestor

Tom O'Lincoln suarsos at alphalink.com.au
Mon Sep 29 16:52:16 MDT 2003

> 2. Lenin's rentier state does not exist.  Moreover, no mechanism for
bribing the working class by distributing profits from more exploited areas
has been
discovered or described.>

Clyder responded:
"There exists a substantial population of unproductive employees of finance
capital whose wages derive from surplus value - the sort of people who were
working in the twin towers. This group is obviously distinct from
productive workers, but still comprises a substantial part of the
population of the US and UK."

Sure. But there's quite a lot of them in the 3d world, too. Bank workers
for example, who were hit quite hard by the 1997-1998 Asian crisis. In
Indonesia they responded by forming trade unions. From the fact that they
are  paid from surplus value it doesn't follow that they're either
privileged or bourgeoisified. Though they used to *think* they were...

>> 3. If the working class is not or no longer permanently unrevolutionary
then it is necessary to dispense IN TOTAL with Marx's analysis of capital
and replace it with some other because Marxism is of a whole; the class
structure and struggle is the logic, the very substance of commodity
production which manifests itself in overproduction ...  destruction of
values, and the necessity-- necessity requiring, meaning AGENT-- of

Clyder: "This strikes me as Hegelian teleology. Why should a working class
who have a reasonably secure and stable
standard of living risk the dangers both economic and physical that
revolution entails?"

I agree. But "reasonably secure and stable" is relative and subjective.
Workers these days are starting to feel insecure, and the system is quite
capable of becoming instable. And that, in turn, makes revolution necessary
though of course...

>>Is it not more likely that the spontaneous form of politics of such a
working class will be social democratic?<<

I agree again. Necessary doesn't mean spontaneous. It just means we need
it. We still have to fight for it.

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