[Marxism] RE: Who is David Cobb?
gojack10 at hotmail.com
Thu Jul 15 08:31:39 MDT 2004
Paul, the problem with your assessment below is that it just flat out flies
against the evidence that history has presented us repeatedly.
I don't know. I think there is a strategic advantage to having a government
that won't push the police state tactic of the current regime. I'll take
less pain right now since I think more pain would push americans toward
nationalist fascism not the creation of a socialist society.>>
This raises a false dichotomy that does not exist between a supposed
possibly more benevolent US president that could supposedly resist against
PURE EVIL as you see it. But how did Bush get into office? The answer to
that, is that it was as much the Democratic Party that put him there, as it
was the Republican Party.
The DP is (and was) no reistance, but is the enabler to what you fear, Paul.
The 'police state tactic of the current regime', was the 'police state
terror' of the previous one. The 'War Against Terrorism' is the 'War
Against Drugs' of the Clinton group. Bush's invasion of Iraq was the end
game of Clinton's sanctions against Iraq, and Clinton's invasion of
Texas Governor Bush was the progeny of Texas liberal Democrat Ann Richards.
Ann gave birth to George. She did not provide resistance to him and his
interests, just as Al Gore didn't either. Carter was not a break from
Nixon, but a door that opened the door to Reaganism. FDR paved the way to
Trumanism and the Witchhunt. How much ignoring of history Cobbism can be
To coddle up to the idea that Kerry represents something better than Bush,
is misleadership by you, Cobb, Michael Moore, Norm Solomon, and so many
others. It is Gus Hallism, not pragmatism. Instead of explaining about
the dictatorship of the capitalists we live under, this type of politics
gives people the false message that 'your vote counts'! Why would you
people do such a thing? This is not socialist politicing, but rather
liberalist bs. It is pushing the idea that democracy consists of votes and
voting in capitalist run elections.
Pain? The great American pain is that the working class gets fed this crap
of 'we are a democracy' day and night, night and day. Paul, you even go so
far as to promote the idea of local-yokel electorialism as being something
that Che and Fidel 'knew about'! Cobb copying Che? Too funny for words
almost! You can't really believe this yourself... And Mao built a movemetn
by organizing an army against the Japanese, not by building strong local
movements around election campaigns.
better or worse, has what I consider to be the right strategy: build strong
local movements that control local governments.>> This is much easier in
rural and semi-rural areas but it is happening. When everyday people find
that people with socialist ideas are just everyday people too and are
actually doing things to help on the local level, at that point it becomes
reasonable to try something greater. Fidel knew this, Che knew this, Mao
knew this. And I don't see how there is any other practical strategy at the
present time for building a mass movement.>>
As far as the Green Party being a 'big tent'? The big tent is the DP, and
the Green Party that Cobb represents is a DP side show. I don't buy the
idea that Greens winning local offices is a means to building mass
movements. Even if Gonzalez had somehow won the mayor's seat in San
Francisco, no mass movement would have shot forth from such an event.
That's not how mass movements get constructed.
<<The Green shopping list (the
values) is a really big tent that unfortunately doesn't have a center pole
to hold it up but right now it's the best place to access the :"legitimate"
political process and thereby continue to organize, Cobb told me that he
does think winning offices is not an end in itself but a means to more
fundamental organizing. Paul>>
One last thing... What the hell is it to talk about the best place to access
the legitimate political process, as you put it? Is that code for saying
that the Green Party should be the grand avenue for socialist election work?
Egads! I'd rather build SWP or SEP campaigns even! Jack Barnes for
If Nader thought that the Greens had become a sinkhole that sucked activism
downhill and out, maybe socailists should examine Nader's reasons for
feeling that way? Building around local dog catcher elections and then
voting Democratic Party at the national level is called doing nothing, Paul.
One should not think of it as good strategy. Cobb has captured nothing.
He has won the undertaker post for the Green Party. Heck, in many a state
he wouldn't even vote for himself. And neither would his mom.
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