[Marxism] RE: USSR, Democracy, and the Environment

Waistline2 at aol.com Waistline2 at aol.com
Sun May 16 11:05:40 MDT 2004

In a message dated 5/16/04 7:59:43 AM Pacific Daylight Time, 
Waistline2 at aol.com writes:

>Soviet socialism was a part of the twentieth century's accommodation with 
the vast upheavals of the nineteenth century, when masses of peasants were 
decanted from the land and sent to work in satanic industrial cities. In fact, 
Soviet socialism exhausted its historical potential by 1945. From that time  
onwards it became a deeply conservative force, a roadblock in the way of 
Once it was swept away, a fortress of old resistance to the curses of 
capitalism, nothing was left to prevent the final emergence of a truly global 
capitalism and its social counterpart, a truly global working class. <


My bad planning gives me a moment to detach from reality and write. The above 
statement by our late comrade Mark Jones is incorrect on face value. One is 
left to ponder in an abstract manner the meaning of "the historical potential" 
of socialism. There are two fundamental approaches to the matter and one is 
purely ideological. 

1. What if fact creates "the historical potential of (Soviet) socialism." 
2.  What if fact creates "the historical potential of socialism." 

Mark answer is the thermodynamic barrier and political structures . . . as a 
side note a misunderstanding of the wall of the law of value in the Soviets 
external relations with capital or the world market. 

Comrade Lou's explanation is basically satanic Stalinism and the ignorance of 
the Stalin Regime. Let us assume this is entirely correct. 

What pray tell halted the intensive development of the industrial machinery 
of Soviet society? What can ease account for what halts the extensive 
development of industrial enterprise because the earth and this continent country is 
finite. What law system or barrier did the Soviets run into and it was not the 
wall of thermodynamics in 1945 - the date Mark gives, although the soviet 
industrial economy - according to everyone did not begin its decline until the 
1960s. Its decline meant a slowing of its rate of expansion and not decline in an 
absolute sense.  

Let us say that Stalin was all wrong about everything. 

Lets deal with political economy from the standpoint of Marx or nothing at 
all. What is the economic basis of the Soviets hitting the wall - from the 
standpoint of the actual industrial process and then we can make sense of the 
political and ideological struggle. Is this not Marx approach. There is nothing in 
Mark Jones writing about the actual process of industrial production as it is 
governed by the law of reproduction and the character of the extensive and 
intensive development Marx speaks of as "cooperation." 

Oil can impact the law of extensive development but not determine it. 
Technology governs the law of intensive development but does not determine its form 
and shape. The property relations determines the form and shape. 

Melvin P. 

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