[Marxism] Communism, anti-German criticism and Israel

Calvin Broadbent calvinbroadbent at hotmail.com
Thu Aug 11 06:56:01 MDT 2005


I WROTE:

"Make that a right-wing liberal pseudo-marxist provocateur."

Such a denunciation does not help me deflect from real argument- it is a 
real argument. Your defense of Israel is right-wing, your deunciations of 
and on political Islam, your defense of Christopher Hitchens and 
'anti-Germans' (eh?) and your pronunciations on council communism, 
nztionalism and the state appear liberal. The sum total of your writing 
appears un-Marxist whilst garbed in the mantle of 'ultra-left' Marxism.

I am not worried about uncomfortable ideas challenging my perceptions. I 
want my ideas to be challenged so as to come to a more coherent and 
realistic perception of things. Your ideas make me uncomfortable because 
they seem ridiculous. There is plenty of people writing to the Marx list 
whom I don't always agree with- I would never wish to see most of them 
disappear from the list.

My suggestion of a vetting procedure was semi-rhetorical. At least such a 
procedure would prevent Zionists and liberals from posting to what is 
supposed to be a marxism list. If I wanted to hear such arguments I would 
subscribe to a liberal and/or Zionist list.

Of course Marxism covers a broad range of political positions. But I don't 
think it should cover defences of Israel and the most abstract posturing 
imaginable (anti-nation-ism, state-ism, Islam-bashing). I am quite confident 
that I have at least as good an understanding of Karl Marx's writings as 
you.

Anyway, if I am 'cynically psychotic' and immature, then you are a pompous 
and reactionary sophist.

ED (OR IS IT BARNEY) THE CLOWN WRITES:

>If such denunciation helps you deflect from real
>argument, be my guest.  It is, after all, only an
>email list.  But this sort of denunciation is straight
>out of a Stalinist playbook.

>You, like a thousand other alleged "Marxists," are
>some sort of activist who has read Lenin's Imperialism
>and mistakes that for having a sufficient knowledge of
>Marx's Capital.

>I don't know what the function of a "vetting
>procedure" would be on a list devoted to open
>discussion amongst Marxists.  If you are worried about
>being confronted with uncomfortable ideas which
>challenge your perceptions, perhaps it would be useful
>to hang out a warning sign of a "common basis of
>political agreement" with some sort of ten point
>program of minimal consensus.

>Otherwise, deal with the fact that Marxist is a term
>broad enough to cover political positions which are
>even diametrically opposed.  In short, grow up.  The
>world is a lot bigger than you imagine.

>I have not once in the course of discussion offered
>any sort of defense of Israeli state crimes.  Yet
>merely by entertaining a critical attitude towards
>"national liberation" struggles with anti-semitic
>elements, I have somehow become to disturbing a
>political presence.  That does not speak well for your
>debating style.  As I stated before, this kind of
>agressive rejection of reality is clinically
>psychotic.

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