[Marxism] Re: msnbc on anti-war protests...

Carlos A. Rivera cerejota at optonline.net
Mon Mar 21 07:08:41 MST 2005

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "M. Junaid Alam" <mjunaidalam at msalam.net>

> More  hyperbole and wild claims as per usual from you, Carlos. What 
> "hateful denunciation"? I never wrote any, never mind "increasing".
> You probably never even read the Bageant pieces, posted on Counterpunch, 
> which are hardly hateful against the working -class, since the guy
> IS working-class and writing about his experiences AMONG working-class 
> Southern whites. His pieces are actually aimed against liberal and leftist
> myths about white workers, both those that build them up or tear them 
> without any concrete examination, a tendency you clearly share.

Actually you miss the point Bageant makes altogether. His point is to attack 
liberal myths on the white workers, that is true. But it is to attack them 
in a positive way. To understand something is a prerequisite to transforming 
it. You seem to read him and say "look, they are just a bunch of fat pigs 
no-brains, lets forget about them". I have not such prejudices.

Lets clarify something, I have no illusions about no working class, not in 
the USA, not in Puerto Rico, not anywhere. But yes, one must learn from the 
masses. I am after all trained off the Red Book. And to discount the masses 
in the USA, is precisely the reason because the Republicans are being able 
to organize them. They don't go and tell them to their face "y'all a bunch 
of cracker hicks".

You seem to be debating someone else when you claim I have any illusions or 
myths. I don't, but I do attempt to raise the issue, however hard of uniting 
all those who can be united. And furthermore, I hold no illusions, like 
those you express, that the USA's working class is any less or more capable 
than those of other countries.

Your diatribes on the other hand, have the usual "hate the white workers" BS 
that liberals in the USA love to spew forth.

For lefty liberals in the USA, progressives are divided essentially into two 
camps, "the minorities" and "us enlightned white academics".

The guy who felt a porn movie about Che being an insult falls in the later 
category, and you seem to fall in the former. Such is a bigger myth than 
thinking MIchael Moore can go revolutionary socialist.

I on the other hand offer up a view that doesn't discount, however 
challenging and hard that work is, the neccesity to organize among whites, 
and not only that, that this organizing is vital for the solving of a lot of 
other problems.

My dad tells me fondly of how in the 70s they used to tell white americans 
who came over to latin america to volunteer as revolutionaries that the best 
way they could help the revolution was by going back and making one in their 
own country. That is still true today as it was then.

The rest personal attacks I wont address. It seems you have gotten your 
underwear all bunched up, all while accusing me of the same. *Yawn*


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