[Marxism] re: Israel lobby controversy

Gilles d'Aymery aymery at ix.netcom.com
Wed Apr 5 01:36:31 MDT 2006

My thanks to David Walters for his comments.

I wish I could insert myself more deeply in this thread. I can't and I do 
not want. I can't because I have a Swans edition to put to bed (and you 
good people don't help me much! :-) ). I do not want because it's a 
discussion that will not sway anyone, one way or the other.

Just for the record, I hold no ill-feeling against Junaid. I disagree 
with him, period.

The pro-Israel (aka, Jewish) lobby is undeniable. It includes many more 
people than Jewish Americans.

I am trying, quite possibly poorly, to raise that very fact: The pro-
Israel lobby encompasses much more than a few American Jews.

I don't see the relevancy of highlighting the "ethnic" constituency of 
the lobby.

I wholeheartedly object to singularizing "the Jewish-American component 
[of the ruling class]" as representing "*a section* of the single 
wealthiest ethnic group in the US today." There are more US Episcopalians 
in position of power than any other so-called "groups."

I furthermore object -- quite strongly -- to this 
intellectual/emotional/racial habit to denominate people according to 
their religion or "ethnicity," or even nationality. S/he black, Jewish, 
French, Argentinean, Muslim, gay, white, martian, etc., etc., etc. This 
objection expands much further that this particular issue.

My point is that the Lobby, like any other lobby, exists and is useful (I 
could easily argue that it is actually quite negative to both US and 
Israeli interests), so long as it serves the elites -- the elites are of 
whatever "ethnic" background and I could not care less about their 
"ethnicity." Here is where Marxists shoud get in and get back to 
discussing the material issues... (sorry, I am not a scholar).

I also, respectfully, take exception to David's characterization that the 
"Zionist entity [is] currently occupying Palestine" -- and I am fully 
aware that I shall henceforth be deemed a pro-Zionist (which is utterly 

But, I have no bone to gnaw on this issue. I strive for a two-state 
solution. Nothing less, nothing more.

The question is: What's the best tactic (strategy) to achieve the two-
state solution?

I personally shall not demonize people be they this or that. Perhaps I am 
"wrong" and should join the legions out there, including Mr. Bush...

We are, as the frog in the pan, facing with complacency the death of the 
oceans, abject poverty around the world, global warming, environmental 
devastation, soil erosion, water shortage, etc. etc., etc, and we keep at 
each other's throats on the merits of whether or not the darn Jews 
control America, the Middle East, and, and, and... Let's rejoice with 
Justin Raimondo and clarion that the Iraq War was maniganced (English?) 
by, and fought on behalf , of that terrible people.

It's power we need to fight, comrades, not denomimations. The lobby sails 
along power. It does not lead it.

Anyway, please keep arguing about the issue. I have to go and take care 
of the chickens before going to bed.

Thanks David and my best to Junaid.

In solidarity, hopefully,
Gilles d'Aymery
Swans Commentary
http://www.swans.com/ (for the members who do not know the URL.....BTW, 
you'll find some interesting exchanges with an Israeli Zionist, if your 
curiosity brings you there.)

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