[Marxism] My good bye to a thug
nmgoro at gmail.com
Wed Apr 1 08:23:33 MDT 2009
[I have been considering whether my "final note" to the Cloke`s thread
was enough. It wasn´t. So that I am sending to the list something I
drafted before that e-mail. There might be some repetitions. But there
is also something else, which I would rather see on the list tan not.]
> Oh, my.
> J.M.P.Cloke at lboro.ac.uk escribió:
>> And therefore, had the Argentinian military dictatorship and its
>> supporting clique amongst the bourgeoisie defeated the UK armed forces
>> and re-established control over the Falklands, thus reinforcing itself
>> in power and strengthening its ability to oppress and commit mass
>> murder against the Argentine working class, petit bourgeoisie and,
>> well, lefties, academics, activists, the usual suspects, that would
>> have been a step forward in the international class struggle, would it?
> Mr. Cloke, the "Argentinian dictatorship" was not such because it was
> "military" but because it was pro-oligarchic, sepoy and pro-imperialist.
> You have not answered to my question on whether you are a Marxist or
> not. From what I have been reading from you, I gather that you aren´t,
> so that I will act, from this posting onwards, in that assumption.
> Had you been a Marxist, I would have had to explain you that the
> concrete derivations of a victorious warfare of a semicolonial country
> with an imperialist and thuggish "democracy" have been analyzed, with
> great cogency and interest by among others Lev Davidovich Bronstein, AKA
> Trotsky, mainly through his experience with the Mexican governmet of
> Lázaro Cárdenas. Among other conclusions, Trotsky discovered that in a
> war between "fascist" Brazil and "democratic" Britain, every Marxist
> should side with Brazil, not less because the defeat of the imperialist
> thug -Britain, I mean- would be a great step ahead in the general
> warfare of the working and oppressed classes against capitalism, but
> also and essentially because once a pro-imperialist authoritarian regime
> (and in a semicolony, this is the _one and single_ serious way you can
> call a regime "fascist") cuts its ties with imperialism, it needs to
> turn to the own people of the semicolony against the attack from
> This is what would have happened in Argentina if the battles of 1982 had
> been won by our Armed Forces. In fact, developments began to appear by
> mid 1982 in that very direction. Which was the main reason why our own
> "democratic" (that is, sepoy) defeatist pro-imperilaists, both military
> and civilian, were so eager to bring the war to a fast British victory
> and dedicated all their efforts to impose as received truth for the
> Argentineans exactly all the rant you are posing here as a question.
> But, as I said, I am not convinced at all that you are a Marxist.
> Thus, I have to understand that you are just another "progressive"
> Under _this_ assumption, my only answer to you can be "Fuck you, thug! I
> hope we meet on the battlefield".
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