[Marxism] self determination for oppressors

Marv Gandall marvgandall at videotron.ca
Sun Oct 18 13:14:49 MDT 2009

Artesian writes:

> Think your missing the point, Marv, which Louis pointed out:  the issue
> isn't culture, or language-- it's the material conditions of exploitation
> and oppression.  No Zionist argues that simply having the ability to teach
> Hebrew or practice the religion satisfies the supposed "need" for a
> "homeland."
This thread has nothing to do with what the Zionists think or want, David.
It's been about the situation of Hebrew-speaking Jews in a post-Zionist
state where a large number of them had presumably waged a joint struggle
with Palestinian Arabs to establish a secular, democratic, even socialist,
political system. By definition, they wouldn't be Zionists favouring an
oppressive "Jewish state", nor would they see themselves as such, and most
would not likely be particularly interested in Hebrew language and cultural
rights or negotiating some degree of political autonomy within the new

But some, like the old Bundists in Eastern Europe, might be. I'm quite
confident that in these circumstances the great majority of the population -
Arabic- and Hebrew-speakers, Muslims and Jews and Christians - would be
receptive to the protection of minority rights, as would the leadership of
the new Palestinian state which, as I noted earlier, would also be conscious
of the need for political unity and economic development. You Brasky, and
Pollock would be on the other side, arguing against any extension of such

So be it. There's plenty more pressing issues to concern us without
expending a lot of time and heat over one which is strictly academic right
now and very unlikely to be presented to us in our lifetime.

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