[Marxism] Evidence that non-USA film critics not that impressed with "Zero Dark Thirty"

Xxxzx Xzyyxzxzxx xxyzxxxxxx at xzxxx.xxx
Thu Dec 20 04:10:37 MST 2012

I have not seen the film and probably  never will  unless the ticket is
free and even then I do not think I will be able to sit for 3 hours.

I respond, because I like 'movies' per se  and I know Mr. Proyect is a film

and I think this movie has serious/serious problems.

Showing torture and making ( or not making) a case for it is probably only
the less problematic aspect of the movie.

I  have much more serious issues with kathryn bigelow - the director

1) She first makes a movie on the 'ongoing iraq war' - 'hurt locker'.  As a
non - american ( but with lots  of friends in America and having lived
there long enuff and being a part of the anti-war movement), I found the
movie 'hurt locker' ( again couldn't spare the money to watch something i
find boring, but read abt the movie) , almost Leni Riefenstahl-ian.

2) What Ms. Bigelow is so off base about  is that unlike WW2, the verdict
has not yet been written on the Iraq war or  the OBL killing.

3) History hasn't passed judgement. For all I know ( and care) America is
firmly  on the 'wrong' side of history on the Iraq war. And this is a fact
which has been admitted by so many world leaders.

4)  You cannot make a movie on war where you are potentially on the 'wrong'
side of history ( whatever be  the byline - ' in  hurt locker ' , the
byline is war is an addiction ( chris hedges, i believe).

5) Hurt Locker itself is a problem movie.

6) To give an example( illustrate). It is like Kevin Costner making a movie
in which he shows how the settlers massacred the 'native indians' and
showing history from their perspective instead of  'Dances with Wolves' -
which was no doubt a much more well- made movie and critically acclaimed.
Or to be even more gross, hollywood making a billion dollar movie about
the  victory of KKK  over ' black folks' in the south in the days of the
yore, or Israel making a movie on how it massacred Palestinians and Arabs (
the last time they fought them) and screening it at  the Cannes and so on...

7) Hollywood is not the problem. Bigelow is.  'Hurt locker' could have been
excused because it is about 'soldiers'  - and anytime you show
'comradeship' it is okay, because in a way it portrays values like
loyalty/courage/faith/leadership/love/care/sacrifice/honor ... all
potentially good stff...

8) But with  the latest version ( again another iraq war movie and OBL in
it to top it!), I can firmly say Bigelow has her brains addled or a she is
a hard right wing conservative,  or she is just stupid and ignorant and
bought in to the 'fox news' propaganda about the iraq war.

9) Ms. Bigelow. I am talking to you.   USA ( your country) is on the
'wrong' side of  history as far as the Iraq war is concerned. And regarding
OBL, please understand tht he and his bunch were your own products - CIA
funded- to fight against Russians.

10) When you make a movie where you  are on the 'wrong' side of history,
you become a card  carrying  zealot, an unabashed patriot.

11) hence I called you 'Leni Riefenstahl' and will continue to call you the
same, no matter what others say to defend you.

You have no idea how badly you have goofed up.  Just because the 'rest of
the world' has been polite enuff to keep their mouths shut, please don't
for a moment think  that you are on the right side of history with all the
wars your country has fought after WW2.

If you don't  believe me, I request you to get an appointment with Mr. Noam
Chomsky who could enlighten you about the 'facts' abt US 'interventions in
the world' post WW2.

kind regards to Mr. Proyect and the list members.

Xxxzx Xzyyxzxzxx

On 19 December 2012 18:51, Louis Proyect  wrote:

> ==============================**==============================**==========
> Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message.
> ==============================**==============================**==========
> (Not that focused on the politics but astute on the film as film.)
> http://www.eyeforfilm.co.uk/**review/zero-dark-thirty-2012-**
> film-review-by-anne-katrin-**titze<http://www.eyeforfilm.co.uk/review/zero-dark-thirty-2012-film-review-by-anne-katrin-titze>
> Zero Dark Thirty
> **1/2
> Reviewed by: Anne-Katrin Titze
> In Zero Dark Thirty, Academy Award winning director Kathryn Bigelow takes
> her audience by the hand and explains, as you might to an inattentive
> child, that the terrorists who caused the 9/11 attacks now have to be
> interrogated.
> The film starts with desperate phone calls from the Twin Towers in 2001,
> heard, not seen. What follow, announced as two years later, are long scenes
> of C.I.A. interrogations, with the implementation of towels, water, chains,
> boxes, cursing, hitting, insults. At first, the interrogators get nowhere;
> then, because of our heroine Maya (Jessica Chastain), whose only goal in
> life is to capture Osama bin Laden, they succeed.
> While it is good to see a woman as the hero of a movie that does not
> include a romantic relationship for her character to balance with her
> duties, Bigelow creates other obstacles. Chastain, the only actor in the
> film to pronounce the name of the al-Qaeda terrorist leader as La-dèn, is
> frightfully unbelievable as a C.I.A. agent, and Bigelow's decision to have
> her chew on things and 'eat like a man' in every second scene does not help
> alter that reality.
> Let's have her eating french fries with ketchup, at her desk in the secret
> location in Pakistan, while she explains her theories to show how tough and
> masculine she is. And a cheeseburger with a coke half an hour later in the
> film, to show how American and patriotic she is, and tough and determined,
> in case you forgot. This is, unfortunately, how one can imagine discussions
> about the script. At the secret CIA "black site" in Gdansk, Poland, she
> even gets to lick her knife while talking "greed and ideology" with female
> colleague Jessica (Jennifer Ehle).
> You could also close your eyes and let the mood music tell you exactly how
> to feel. Helicopter sounds, everyone speaking very fast at meetings in
> Langley, Virginia, so that we know it's business and serious, alternate
> with historical events. The search includes the shoe bomber conspiracy, the
> London bus bombings in July 2005, and the attack on the Karachi Marriott in
> 2008. Bigelow shows them as TV news, reenacts them, and has the events
> discussed by American agents. If you've read the paper during the last ten
> years, you won't get much new insight here.
> Maya's friendly C.I.A. superior Dan (Jason Clarke), who instructs her and
> does most of the torturing with a kind and concerned face, calls the
> terrorists "Bro'" at the end of his sentences, and keeps repeating, what, I
> suppose, is the central message of the movie: ''When you lie to me, I hurt
> you.''
> Jennifer Ehle as the second female agent does not get a chance to shine
> and is left to deliver lines in a hotel such as "We're socialising. Be
> social!" to knife licker Chastain.
> Telegraphing scenes, so that even a halfway sensitive audience can
> anticipate exactly when to put its hands up to cover ears and eyes, is not
> a compromise worth making, except maybe at the box office. In Zero Dark
> Thirty you can study the conventions of how to film a person getting into a
> car that will be shot at. Everything is summed up and packaged neatly so as
> to not challenge the audience. Nothing surprises. What did you expect?
> Secrets revealed in a big Hollywood movie.
> "That's not normal guy behavior. That's trade craft," explains Chastain's
> Maya about a suspect. Unfortunately, the same goes for her and all the
> other actors. Going on for nearly three hours, the predictability makes you
> drag along to see the scenes leading up to the capture. Writing numbers
> with a red pen on the glass of an inter-office wall to indicate that the
> men don't know what they are doing and that our heroine, who figured it all
> out, is impatient, does not create suspense, nor does it give any insight
> into human interactions in offices outside of fantasy land.
> It appears the "strong female" in mainstream Hollywood productions still
> has to sell a Julia Roberts as Erin Brockovich-style quirkiness to convey
> confidence. And I don't mean a way of dressing. I had to think about
> Disney's Beauty And The Beast while watching Zero Dark Thirty. Maya and bin
> La-dèn.
> Following the critical success and honors bestowed upon her for The Hurt
> Locker, Bigelow appears to have been hired and asked to do the job the
> Hollywood financial backers wanted, instead of making her own film.
> An American in Pakistan, the Musical - it could become a big hit on
> Broadway with Julie Taymor directing.
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