[Marxism] Facing bad choices, in or out of the euro, Greece needs our solidarity

Sheldon Ranz sranz18 at gmail.com
Fri Jul 10 12:30:44 MDT 2015

Using your logic, you could similar excuses for Obama.

Apparently, there are no lies in politics, according to you, because we
were always supposed to know that elected leaders have "a game". So, the
Greek people have no justification for feeling betrayed.  So, if a loved
one is murdered, should I shrug it off and say, "Oh well, we all have to
die sometime."

And what's this about Allende?  What lies did he tell?  What referendum did
he betray?

On Fri, Jul 10, 2015 at 4:35 AM, ioannis aposperites via Marxism <
marxism at lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote:

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> On 10/07/2015 05:57 πμ, Sheldon Ranz via Marxism wrote:
>  Excuse me, but NO ONE at the Troika forced Syriza to organize a
>> referendum.  Tsipras and Co. chose that, and now have chosen to ignore the
>> results of the referendum in favor of the Troika's demands.
>> How is that not treachery?
> Allende's policy wasn't a treachery? Yet he saved the honor of the left by
> his resistance till the end. Isn't it strange that the political forces in
> Chile of 1973 who had foreseen the disaster and were advocating for the
> masses to be mobilized and the "Cordones Industriales" to take action etc
> are now widely forgotten, and often ruthlessly criticized inside the
> revolutionary left, while the "traitor" is a symbol of resistance
> internationally?
> The word treachery and the likes are good for agitation but not so good
> for propaganda and even less for politics. Politics is not a question of
> moral nor of ethics; it's about class struggle and correlation of forces.
> On the other hand Tsipras was clear from the beginning: His government was
> declared to be a national salvation government. The promises to the
> proletariat were supposed to be the outcome of a fair class collaboration
> and were conditioned by that collaboration as long as the bourgeoisie had
> to be also satisfied. You like it or not, that was Tsipras' game. Of course
> the greek working class and its other political forces were and are playing
> a variety of different games, but that does not regard Tsipras'
> intentions.  Conclusion: speaking of treachery is not even technically
> correct.
> JA
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