[Marxism] Jew baiting (was: Time to recall that the enemy is at home)

A.R. G amithrgupta at gmail.com
Mon Oct 19 05:29:22 MDT 2015


Personally I don't think that *any* references to Jewish privileging,
especially in Palestine circles, should be ban-worthy. Also, there is an
actual phenomenon called liberal Zionism and it does, in fact, have an
excessive influence on the US left.

But I think Mark Richey's comments are crude and and unsophisticated and
uncalled for, and like Jeff says there's no sociological relevance. So for
once, I kind of agree with Jeff.

I admit, I made a mistake of bringing up the rumor against Mark.

- Amith

On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 7:10 AM, Jeff via Marxism <
marxism at lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote:

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> At 14:18 19-10-15 +0800, Mark Richey via Marxism wrote:
> >
> >What I can document
>
> For starters, we don't want to hear claims of what someone "can document."
> Someone who wants to make an argument just sends the documentation, period.
> When the most you can say is that you "can document" something, it's
> usually because you can't. Likewise when "everyone knows" some fact (e.g.
> about Syria) it usually means no one actually knows it.
>
> But getting to the point:
>
> > is that 'solidarity' activists anywhere in the US are overwhelmingly
> >liberal zionist, Jewish cliquists,
>
> In any political discussion, identifying ethnicity/religion of participants
> when there is no sociological relevance is properly frowned up. Much more
> serious however are such reference in relationship to activists who you are
> in discussion with, even indirectly. The discussion on this list has to
> center on the ideas being expressed, not on who's expressing them, and
> absolutely not on unrelated factors about those individuals, most of all
> factors that have been associated with discrimination or oppression.
>
> It is particularly egregious when such a reference conjures up racist myths
> about "Jewish domination" or conspiracies, as these are lies that are
> associated with past genocide. Labelling any activists who work in the
> interests of Palestine "Zionist" is a particularly vicious and disruptive
> charge since it's the same as saying that they are on the side of the enemy
> (just like a false charge of someone being an informer). I have never seen
> a phrase such as "liberal zionist, Jewish cliquists" thrown around on this
> list (or in any acceptable discussion) and absolutely do not expect to see
> it again.
>
> I imagine the only reason the moderator has allowed this person to get this
> far, is that because his contributions to the discussion are so disgusting
> that they actually benefit the other side. And that his statements are so
> easy to counter. But frankly if Louis would like to have a discussion about
> Syria with the pro-Assad left, I'd really prefer if it was with Brian
> Becker or Franklin Lamb, so that the victory of his argumentation would
> mean something.
>
> I have seen no evidence that this person has anything useful to contribute
> to this list or has any intention of discussing ideas in good faith. And
> the use of ethnic references of the sort I mentioned is completely
> unacceptable and shouldn't be tolerated in the least.
>
> - Jeff
>
> such as MECA, JVP, IJAN, etc. Such is the
> >case in the Bay Area where most are in the wake of Barbara Lubin, the
> alter
> >ego of MECA, essentially a two Jewish woman operation, but which people
> like
> >AR parrot mindlessly.  After all, they're Jewish, they must be
> right..
> >Set your options at:
> http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/meisner%40xs4all.nl
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