[Marxism] Building for a Socialist Brexit

Carl G. Estabrook galliher at illinois.edu
Wed Jul 11 18:00:00 MDT 2018


Maybe John would like to respond to Tuck’s histroically-based argument that Brexit responds to working-class interests.


> On Jul 11, 2018, at 6:18 PM, John Reimann <1999wildcat at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I may be mistaken, but I do believe that Marx died well before the EU came into existence.
> 
> Of course, this is a snarky way of saying that he was writing about an entirely different period in the development of capitalism. The EU is a symptom of the problem; it's not the problem itself.
> 
> Maybe Carl would like to respond to the main points of my comments instead of citing an article from "Dissent" (from what?) magazine.
> 
> John Reimann
> 
> On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 2:06 PM, Carl G. Estabrook <galliher at illinois.edu <mailto:galliher at illinois.edu>> wrote:
> A weel-known socialist might disagree with you. Marx might think it worthwhile to be free of EU ‘constitutionalism’:
> 
> https://www.dissentmagazine.org/online_articles/left-case-brexit <https://www.dissentmagazine.org/online_articles/left-case-brexit>
> 
> —CGE
> 
> 
>> On Jul 11, 2018, at 3:57 PM, John Reimann via Marxism <marxism at lists.csbs.utah.edu <mailto:marxism at lists.csbs.utah.edu>> wrote:
>> "What we now need is a socialist Brexit." Yes, and what the jumper from the
>> Golden Gate Bridge needed was the suspension of the laws of gravity.
>> Unfortunately for both the jumper and the "Lexiteers", I'm not sure which
>> is less likely.
>> 
>> A lot of things can be said and a lot denied about the Brexit vote. One
>> thing that cannot be denied with any degree of truth is that it was a right
>> wing, anti-immigrant vote. Sure, some - maybe most - of the workers who
>> voted for Brexit may not have been chauvinists, but every single interview
>> I saw of Brexit voters, including some pro-Brexit interviews, showed the
>> workers as saying that first and foremost the reason they voted for Brexit
>> was immigration.
>> 
>> The entire Brexit vote was predicated on the idea that workers would be
>> better off under the rule of British capitalism vs. European capitalism.
>> This means that British workers should ally themselves with with the
>> British capitalist class. Inevitably, this means at the cost of allying
>> itself with the European working class.
>> 
>> Unfortunately, the anti-Brexit campaign limited itself in this sense: It
>> wasn't enough to campaign *against *Brexit; it was and is necessary to link
>> that with a campaign *for* something. That "something" was and is
>> pan-European working class unity and a pan-European campaign for a
>> region-wide minimum wage, region-wide minimum social safety net, etc. The
>> Brexit vote makes that all the more difficult.
>> 
>> As far as the issue of the EU enforcing austerity: We should remember
>> Marx's comment that law represents established fact. So do the EU mandates,
>> and the established fact is that EU mandates or not, global capitalism
>> requires national austerity. Show me one single capitalist government - EU
>> member or not - that is not enforcing this sort of austerity.
>> 
>> The "left" can comfort itself with "Lexit" all it likes. It remains nothing
>> but a nice fairy tale which was and is preordained to come into existence
>> as much as is the tale of Cinderella.
>> 
>> John Reimann
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> “In politics, abstract terms conceal treachery.” from "The Black Jacobins" by C. L. R. James
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